[David I.]

caivrete
How are you all? My brain is still spinning... Anyways. I am definitely having problems with accents so if you feel like posting what you do understand that would be cool. I am having trouble with enclitics and nouns. I think I might be slowly getting it though. I have a question... In the case of a long ultima if there is an accent on the ultima and somehow <I don't understand when this would occur> there was a circumflex on the ultima... would it turn into a grave if the was no puncuation following? I know it would if there was an acute but.... Anyways
e[rrwso

[Mr. Schwandt]

cai`rete

Great question!

According to our rules you won't see a circumflex on the ultima of verbs since their accents are recessive. (There will be one notable exception to this to be learned later)

However, we often find the ultima accented on nouns since their accenting rule is retentive and some nouns just like to be naturally be accented on the last syllable.

Circumflexes never change to graves.

e[rrwso

[RuthEmilyZ]

I'm afraid I don't understand why a word can only be accented on the last three syllables. What if you have a word with six or seven syllables?

Very Confused But Trying Hard To Understand

[Mr. Schwandt]

Keep up the effort. We will pull through these clouds quickly.

Words can only be accented on the last three syllables (even if they have six or seven) because that is the way the Greeks like to pronounce and form their language. We just have to start with this rule (#1 in my text). Thankfully it reduces our choices on those longer words.

[David I.]

This is driving me insane but I think I am getting it... maybe=) The nouns are really confusing me though... I think I need to read that chapter again.. for the third or fourth time

[Mr. Schwandt]

Also try reading Machen chapter 2 and doing his exercises. They are a nice intermediate step.

[David I.]

In you dialogue you say..
ajdelqhv cai:re
wouldn't the acute on ajdelqev be a grave because there is no following puncuation?
And how do we tell again if a word is an enclitic or proclitic?

[RuthEmilyZ]

Just a suggestion,
I found it very helpful to go back and read pages 10 through 13 of Chapter 1. I think I am slowly getting this, and I'm certainly glad we're going to spend another week on it!

[Mr. Schwandt]

Good advise.

Great question David. There should be a comma after ajdelfhv which would qualify as punctuation.

[Brandon_Ennis]

I'd like to ask a little more about David's question. If the dialouge were to continue without a comma, would the word be acented with a grave.
Thanks


EÆrrwso

[Mr. Schwandt]

That is exactly right

[David I.]

In the chap 3 dialogue. Why is there an acute over ou{toV?
With the ultima short and the penult long wouldn't that qualify for a circumflex?? Thanks

[Mr. Schwandt]

Great observation, David! You have correctly identified a mistake in my text. This shows that you are really understanding the material. I will immediately correct the problem.

This a great example of what happens to word which wants to retain its accent on the penult. If the ultima is long we have no other options than an acute since circumflex cannot move that far back under the conditions of a long ultima. If the ultima is short the circumflex is now available for the penult and must be placed there if the penult is long. This is what is going on with ou|toV.

Everyone, please do not hesitate to question the text. These types of questions help everyone.

Thanks, David.